Mother Jones - Comments for "Wind Turbines Decimate Bats"

we'll hear that the

we'll hear that the companies operating the turbines will turn them off at night during the migratory period.

This particular area with

This particular area with regard to bat migrations but it is, after all, on the edge of the Great Atlantic Flyway where countless birds, endangered and otherwise, pass.

the PUBLIC SPACE of

the PUBLIC SPACE of Nantucket Sound. There's very little research on this particular area with regard to bat migrations but it is, after all, on the edge of the Great Atlantic Flyway where countless birds, endangered and otherwise, pass.

Bats and wind turbines

Funny how the argument that cats kill more, or cars kill more, is not recognized as totally irrational. Why don't we use that logic for murderers. Since more people get killed by traffic accidents than by serial killers, where is the harm in having a few axe murders running around? Could really liven things up, so to speak. Put the fright back into Halloween, make our lives richer, spookier.
The harm in the case of wind turbines is that the effect is cumulative and there is a lot of turbines with lots more planned. But people still eat up the BS spewed by promoters. Bats are not high on most folks lists of important things but our ecosystems cannot be healthy without them. We are altering the planet in a huge way with wind turbines. A inefficient, intermittent, expensive boondoggle. All bow to political correctness and the mighty turbine.

including hoary bats,

including hoary bats, eastern red bats, and silver-haired bats. Little is known about their population sizes. But wind turbines could devastate them. . . Simple solution. Don't run the turbines at night.

Cape Wind drives us bats!

I've been looking into migratory patterns for bats near Cape Cod, Massachusetts where the Cape Wind CORPORATION wants to build an industrial wind plant the size of Manhattan in the PUBLIC SPACE of Nantucket Sound. There's very little research on this particular area with regard to bat migrations but it is, after all, on the edge of the Great Atlantic Flyway where countless birds, endangered and otherwise, pass. We call Cape Wind, the right project in the WRONG place. Sadly, Big Enviro groups like Greenpeace have become boosters (should i say privateers?) for the corporate privatization of The Commons.

Are any of you aware of all the countries that have been running wind turbines for years? They are just fine. And while it is a terrible thing to have these mortality rates in bats, there is almost certainly a way to keep them away. Problem solved.

Many before me are saying that the turbines would affect water supplies. Why and how? Is it because foundations for these devices would go deep into the ground and disrupt underground springs and rivers? Would someone kindly explain? I understand the threat to birds and bats, though the Audubon Society of Mass studied the matter and determined the threat to birds by ocean installed turbines would be minimal. Many thanks

Have any phenomena such as dead birds and bats been reported near the windmills in the Netherlands that have been running several hundred years?
(Sancho Panza notwithstanding)

ratchety, just what is your justification for your statements about how many birds/bats that are killed?

08/27/08

Where I live we fought off the Wind Turbines from coming in our county. They were going to put up 127 of them. They would of caused wells and springs that provide water to drink and farms growing vegetables and live stock to disappear. Peoples homes would become emtpy. We would of lost our homes as no source for water. Those Wind Turbines go deep into the ground doing great damage. By cutting into the natural springs that provide water something we can never put a price on as much as it is becoming the new Gold not just in America but around the World. Without water no life of any kind can maintain.

When it comes to Bats and Birds 2 counties on either side of me have put in 75 Wind Turbines and on the other side 176 are going in covering a 23 mile span on one side and a 14 mile span on the other side. They fought it in the courts like we did but they lost but we won.

Now my friends who live next to these Wind Turbines shovel every few days wheel barrels full of dead Birds and Bats. Once the Birds and Bats are killed off our eco system will be in grave danager all for the cost of 1% of Energy these Wind Turbines Machines produce as long as the wind is blowing.

In our court case we were able to prove the endangerment of rare Bats that are protected under Federal Law would be killed and Birds. If it had been allowed to have them in my county the county would be paid from the Wind Turbine company $161,000 dollars a year and the power would of been sold to Florida 989 miles away. The power is not used for where the Wind Turbines are put. These Wind Turbine Companies are the crookest group of thugs you will ever deal with next to Power Companies and Gas and Oil Companies. They have no care for the environment only the GREED they want to obtain.

After a 3 year study of Wind Turbines I have learned the cost for each Turbine will not pay for the energy it produces for for over 20 years. 2nd, they have to be maintained 2 times a week, everyone one of them. A person has to go into the depths of the towers to clean any dust on the gears from the shaft going all the way up to the top of the Wind Turbine and many times they have been bitten by Rattle Snakes that have gotten in. They also have to climb inside the Towers of these Wind Turbines after cleaning in the deep ground base to them and open up a hatch and clip onto a hook to keep from falling off the platform the Blades are attached to. They are on their own with no other worker with them.

Then they have to tighten up each bolt on a 6 foot wide by 10 foot wide base they walk on while hooked onto a safty line as the wind, weather cold or heat causes to loosen up the bolts. This has to be done to each Wind Turbine 2 times a week. These workers are on their own and work 8 to 10 hour days to keep the Wind Turbines working.

I also discovered it would not be possible to reap the cost of the Wind Turbines for the Energy they produce for the life time they would be operating.

Realizing we have to have a eco system of Birds and Bats or the very life of human life will be gone. These are just the facts.

I have studied the Salt Flats of Utah go for hundreds of miles and have plenty of wind. Many studies have been made and show this is the best place to have a massive Wind Turbine Complex with a huge Grid running power to be then sold to power companies or Co-Op Power Companies.

T.Bone Pikens at 80 years old has launched a huge campaign to build Wind Turbines from Texas to the Canadian Boarder. I am sure he thinks this is the way he wants to spend his Billions.

There are many down sides that have not been really talked about in the media about this plan. For one to get the right of way to have them put on all the properties will take many years to have accomplished if they can get it all from Texas to the Canadian Boarder. 2nd, citizens have to realize the danagers of water supplies lost from the Wind Turbines cause. 3rd, the Birds and Bats that are killed every day is off the charts and some people have no care for the eco system but what they want without thinking the end result.

Friends of mine who have to live near these Wind Turbines have to sleep with ear plugs from the sounds these Wind Turbines create. They did not sell their land to have them put in but where they are put in on land next to the land they have owned for years. People have lost water supplies and must have water delivered by truck if they are to stay in their homes and for others to maintain their farms. The cost of this is off the charts for 99% of the people effected by Wind Turbines being installed.

In most states the Wind Turbine Companies go to the State Utilite Commisions to file to get a permit to survey land for Wind Turbine instulation. 2nd it is done with little public awareness. Then once they get the surveys done they go back to the State Utilite Commision and get a permit to have installed. They hoodwink the counties they want to put the Wind Turbines in and sell them a bill of goods. They never tell the citizens in the counties they are going in of all the dangers of the Wind Turbines will produce.

What T.Bone Pickens is wanting to do will cause grave damage to not only the water supplies of homes and farms and businesses but for the Birds and Bats and from Tornado's and Storms when these Wind Turbines are in place. Having a 280 foot Wind Turbine fall on your house or barn or building of business as many are located near is not something the average citizen has a clue to understand it will happen. Natures wrath is not something even the best built Wind Turbines can withstand.

With the weather patterns so changed in America the past 20 years and getting worse every season and year it makes no logic to have these Wind Turbines installed other than in the Salt Flats of Utah where no one lives and can cause no damage to Birds and Bats as this is not an area they fly in or live in.

Some of the greatest ideas are not always the best or logical. If T. Bone Pickens and any of these Wind Turbine Companies want to spend Billions of Dollars on Wind Power they should instead make it possible for the low cost of Solar Cells to be installed on as many homes and barns and business's in America as possible as the cost for Solar Cell Panels produce power 24/7 even on days there are cloudy days. The life time of Solar Cell Panels on Roofs is many decades and does not cause the death of our eco system nor the Death of Birds and Bats.

Bats operate on sonar as they can not see. Due to the counties on either side of me since the Wind Turbines have been built in the last 2 years I have seen personally the change they have made. I always use to have Bats and many Birds year round and always Bats in the Summer. I have not seen a Bat in 2 years and the Birds have dropped in 1/2 the number they use to be nesting where I live. I also must state where I live is very rural so for this amazing shock of loss of Bats and Birds is alarming. This is not something to brush off as where I live as I have for many years and it is no coincidence but a fact that the Wind Turbines have and are a major danger to the eco system. Many might not think Bats are living in Cities but they surely do as Birds do also. In Austin, Texas there is a bridge that people go to see every year as over 1/2 Million Bats take off every Sunset and have become a tourist attraction for people to see them in mass take off every early eve. I remember in my youth seeing this happen from an old Opera House that was 5 stories tall and they lived in the 5th floor. Each night they would take off by the thousands in a huge black cloud of Bats as it is in Austin, Texas.

With out Birds and Bats the Insect population will grow out of control.

There is already in America a disease that is killing off Bats from the chemicals used by Commercial Corporate Farms. The 'Bat's' eat the insects that have pollinated from these Commercial Corporate Farms and when the Bats come out in the late Spring. The Bats have limited energy from the disease the chemicals used on Veg's, Wheat and Corn and Soybean crops. They have a white line across their face down near their nose. Bats eat thousands of insects every night and then fly back to where they nest. Some in caves and some in tree's. When they go into sleep for the winter they come out with little energy and die from the disease the Corporate Commercial Farms have produced. Without Bats and Birds we as a planet will be surely doomed.

Many people have the feeling they as humans and will only live so long and so what if Bats and Birds are killed off? They have no logic in thinking they will surely live and not die to see the eco system destroyed by the use of Wind Turbines in the wrong locations. Ignorance is not an acceptable excuse as each of us must be educated in what keeps the life of all living critters maintaining on the Earth on the ground and in the oceans and seas below we call home.

I know one person very well who's house is located right next on property next to theirs and they have not been able to sleep a nights sleep or days sleep from the nose the Wind Turbines produce. They had no idea how to fight from having them installed next to their home as it was already to late to file a protest in court. They own their home and can not sell it once people see the Wind Turbines and hear the nose they produce. The dead Bats and Birds at the base of these Wind Turbines piles up and also on their property.

I then hear people saying, "the solar panels are so costly so how can we afford to have them put on our roofs, barns, apartment buildings and businesses.?" It is much easier to get permits to have solar panels put on your roof or the owner to have them on apartment buildings as in almost any state in America if it is a business they are given tax breaks to have them installed. Also for the private owner they can sell back the power they do not use with Solar Panels if they go complete solar panels on their roofs. In some cases roofs have been removed and thick insulation panels have been put on and then solar panels looking like shingles and tile roofing so there are many choices in how your roof can look.

Yes I know Solar Panels are costly. There are though Solar Panels you can get to put on the Dash of your Car or Pick Up Truck and plug into the cig lighter or have wired in the electrical system of your vehicle. This keeps the Battery of your car or truck charged year round. This surely saves on having to buy batteries when they have a 5 year shelf life of use in a car and truck with Solar Panel charger.

You can also get small solar panels to operate Flood Lights outside of your homes that have a 10 hour storage time and are motion activated as you can have them work either way. You can also use these Floods to operate with Light Bulbs for inside your home as the Solar Panel is on the outside of your home or business and wires to having inside are not hard to accomplish.

There are also Refrig's that run on L.P. Gas that is something America has the most of as in 90% of the Worlds Natural Gas. The Refrigs are full size and work year round. You can save by having L.P. Gas or Natural Gas Stoves and Ovens. You can also have your small Solar Panels no more than the size of these Solar Panels 1 foot by 2 feet and attached to the roof on the corner of your condo, house, apartment or business and run the wires inside the house or business. They will charge your batteries you use for radio's and flash lights. You can run a small TV and Dish Satellite from this system to charge large car or pick up type batteries to convert DC to AC use to power to watch TV and Satellites. The uses are unlimited so it is not something we can not be kept from getting at low cost and save from having to give to the power company. There are also the Garden Lights that so many have used with electric wires in the ground. Now they have at Home Depot or Lowe's Home Improvemnt Stores the same lights but have Solar Panels on top and most sell 6 for $49.99 and sometimes are on sale for $29.99. All you have to do is Google Solar Panels and it will open a huge door for use in small ways to save you money from electric bills and to maintain when power outages happen. They also can provide to keep PC's and Computers running with the needed amount of Car or Truck Batteries to store up the power for many hours of use from the small amount of Solar Panels attached to the corner of your roofs or patio's if you have a condo or apartment.

Many people have furnaces that have fans that run them with L.P. Gas or Natural Gas to heat their homes with. To operate the fans and pumps they are on 110 Volts AC and can maintain heating your home for so many hours each day or night or when power is out from the power companies.

So let us not close our minds to the alternatives we have that are very low cost that will save us from giving it to the power companies by buying one time the items I have shared. I surely am very thankful there is a choice I can maintain a choice other than giving it up to the Power Company 24/7. Power outages happen from storms and freezing weather. The low cost of back up Solar Panels to keep warm or using it each day or night to save on power bills is just logical to have working for each of us.

So when it comes to Wind Turbines, think twice and 3 times before you allow them to be in your back yard or mountain tops or have no choice to live where you do now when the water is gone from having these Wind Turbines installed and cut the flow of natural Springs and Wells providing you the daily needs of water. There are always better ways to get energy than to allow more Power Companies to own the Wind and Sun as they will with these huge Wind Turbines if they are not put in the right locations to not damage the lives of Birds and Bats in our eco system and water supplies we have to have to live.

On Cape Cod they have wanted to put 144 Wind Turbines 6 miles off Cape Cod and as of this writing I do not know if it has passed but if it has it will cause fish life and whales and dolphins to have grave damage to their well being. The Earth is very fragile. As strong as we might think the Earth is, this is and has never been the case. So instead of jumping on the band wagon to allow Wind Turbines put in where you live, learn about them and how they will effect your life and homes and businesses.

Fight to keep them out of your back yard or county you live in as there are locations in America Wind Farms can be built that will not harm the use of our drinking water and farms for growing food we have to eat and will not damage the lives of the Birds and Bats.

Oh and yes they have little Red Lights on top that blink that are to stop a plane from flying into them. Well those Red Lights do not show up in the fog or heavy clouds unless the pilot is right eye to eye with them just before their planes hit them and crash and in most cases the lives on those planes will die. Life is an amazing gift and so is the Earth an amazing gift.

Oh I keep forgetting, T. Bone Pickens is not having his Wind Turbines built in America he is having them built in China by Slave Labor. He has set up plants in China. So much for T. Bone Pickens providing jobs in America and instead outsourcing as all the Corporations in America have done to keep Americans from having the basics and jobs in America. Maybe T. Bone Pickens needs to hear from his fellow citizens that if he thinks a Wind Turbine Farm from Texas to the Canada boarder is so great he 1st needs to have them built in America and no place else and give Americans back their jobs they have lost in the millions of Jobs from oursourcing. 2nd for him to not built from Texas to the Canadian Border but in the Salt Flats in Utah.

Keep Hope Alive? I sincerley hope so. As one can not put the cart before the horse and then after the fact expect to have any horse beable to pull a cart then.

If our present generation does not wake up to what is happening and expecting what we are called the 'Old Guard' to keep fighting to have the right things done right, then for the present and future generations they will have no recourse, as the damage will have been done. There will then be no turning back ever.

What hath man wrought?????

I am willing to stop the blades from moving at critical times but the guys whose cash flow comes from those wind turbines will gladly sacrifice much living tissue for a few more cents per day.

Being blind to a real problem is not "getting with the program"--that's a disconnect with reality that's more characteristic of the Republican Party. Ignoring or relabeling a problem won't make it go away. In fact, the larger wind turbines do kill bats, because the pressure differential between the air in the turbine path and undisturbed air is enough to injure the bats' lungs. If the facts indicate that wind turbines kill bats and birds, we need to find a way to deal with it. We cannot afford to degrade vital bird and bat populations to generate power. Options include siting turbines in places that don't interrupt migratory paths, sonic signals, or possibly turning off the turbines at night during migration periods. "Getting with the program" isn't solving the problem.

Once again, Mother Jones can only look at the dark side. Larger f'ing turbines that turn slowly kill very few birds and very few bats. Even the small turbines that whip around fast probably kill fewer animals than your average patio window and certainly fewer than a coal power plant, so why can you guys get with the program and help us all move forward???