Mother Jones - Comments for "Stimulate Me!"

Agree on payroll tax holiday. Immediate demand stimulus. Goes to middle class. see her

There's likely to be some extra employment from Thanksgiving on through the new year, so it might be possible to not put as much into the top two items.

Better is to have a temporary payroll tax holiday and spend on infrastructure which will employ the kinds of people who don't get those extra holiday jobs.

Put America to work!

Only then, if there's still weaknesses in the economy the top two UI and Food Stamps should kick in.

Actually, the "spending on infrastructure will come too late to help" argument is not entirely true. Some infrastructure spending falls into this category. However, recessions cause belt tightening for states and other governmental units that cannot run deficits. They actually DELAY infrastructure projects or take projects all ready to go OFF the TABLE or slow down the rate of work. These projects CAN be implemented in a SHORT time window if the Feds provide revenue to states and local governments that otherwise would be cutting back.

The Economic Policy Institute has identified a large number of infrastructure projects that could be implemented as a short term stimulus.

http://www.epi.org/webfeatures/viewpoints/20081024_jb_testimony.pdf

The graph should have been in color.

You know, red for GOP proposals, blue for Dem. ones.

Seriously, Kevin. How can you possibly say no on 1a when you have this in front of you? Yes, ballot propositions have some flaws usually, but the project is a good one. And that email that "persuaded" you has been taken apart by other bloggers today.

Obviously, EPI = a bunch of DFH socialists.

Nothing to see here. Move along and let's make those tax cuts permanent.

Thus, support Prop 1a, which has a large project already well planned. It is exactly the kind of project Obama will be looking to support.

reboot: What the chart shows is not really all that helpful as it demonstrates the effect of a program on the "overall economy" ... What is really needed is something that shows how these would affect workers vs. corporations etc

The chart is very helpful, because the measures that most improve the "overall economy" are also the most egalitarian ones.

Why argue about which is more important, when there is no tradeoff required?

PTate in MN: Do I read this correctly?

Not only do you read it correctly, but there is nothing new or surprising in it. While EPI's chart is a helpful reminder, the fiscal stimulus effect of various options has been well understood for a long time. Nor is it another economic "theory" that's suitable fodder for ideological debates - it's been empirically verified by decades of research.

Do I read this correctly? For every dollar invested in Bush economic policies--reducing capital gains, reducing taxes on corporations, making the Bush tax cuts permanent, accelerating depreciation-- the American economy gets LESS than a dollar in return?

Sometimes, even now, even after eight years of this crap, I am astonished by Republican douchbaggery.

Could we please start calling this "Demand-side economics"? That is what it is, and it distinguises it both from conservative supply-siders as well as Marxists and other 20th century style socialisms that were also supply-side, caring more about who owns the means of production than about who is ultimately rewarding production.

Must be my imagination, but the 4-5 Republican options at the bottom sure do suck compared to the Democratic options at the top.

Kevin,

What the chart shows is not really all that helpful as it demonstrates the effect of a program on the "overall economy". That has been the rather misleading focus of the last 8 years.

What is really needed is something that shows how these would affect workers vs. corporations etc in the short/immediate term; without assuming some magical trickle-down economic effect, which is really unproven.

"(b) infrastructure, because the recession is likely to be long and infrastructure projects take a while to get up and running,"

But not infrastructure projects like Prop. 1A, because (among other things) it would take too long.

Man, that's an ugly chart.

The problem with the economy is clearly on the demand side, which the top four options deal with.

The GOP is still stuck on the supply side, which justifies lower taxes on investment and on the wealthy. I'm not saying that a supply-side problem is impossible, but it's just not the case now.

It's hard to believe, but McCain is still calling for cuts in federal spending. I guess he's determined to be another Hoover.

But I'm not the first to observe that helping people who actually need help is somehow class warfare, AKA socialism.

Never mind that that people will take their food stamps to a privately-sector supermarket and buy food, which through the magic of the marketplace makes a profit for the supermarket's shareholders. That takes too long. The investing class needs their money NOW.