Mother Jones - Comments for "Stimulus Is for Suckers"

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Well folks, what a nice

Well folks, what a nice graph and what a nice and long discussion. Mike at the the jump manual review and pit bike store guide.

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By the way, what about some more costs to Galbraith's plan??? So we borrow $1 from a taxpayer and give it to another citizen in the form of a food stamp. They spend it and create $1.73 in local stimulus... so it goes. How much in present value will it cost the government to pay back the $1 it borrows today? (assumming that it will ever be paid back). What is the present value of a $1 paid back in 10 or 20 years? In other words, after accounting for inflation and/or lost interest, how much will the government have to tax our children in 20 years to pay off today's stimulus?

I cannot believe Galbraith teaches at the University level. He has apparently ignored the "Broken Window Fallacy of Economics." Fredric Bastiat, 19th century French economist, warned us of the broken window fallacy long ago. He also states that the bad economist focuses on what is seen, but the good economist focuses on both what is seen and what is unforseen. If it is true that a dollar of stimulaus money puts $1.73 back into the economy if spent on food stamps, then won't that same dollar do the same thing if I spend it on food at my grocery store? This chart represents bad economic thinking. I wouldn't accept it at the high school level. The stimulus spending on most of the above categories in the chart only represent a TRANSFER of spending, not new spending. Instead of a taxpayer spending their own dollars, the government will tax us (what about the cost of compliance and collection of taxes Prof. Galbraith) and then give it to someone else to spend. This is not new spending. Come on, give me a break.

Until Washington politicians provide a “stimulus” by taking a percentage cut in their own salaries and benefits on the same level as the declines in the stock market that they caused with decades of “petty grievances and false promises, the recriminations and worn-out dogmas, that for far too long have strangled our politics” America cannot achieve a lasting recovery.

It is way past due time for Congress to take responsibility and accept accountability for their culture of gross negligence and demonstrate a leadership example at last that shows they are willing to share the pain that they have created by causing lost jobs, lost industries, and lost wealth of America resulting in out of control poverty and a devastated American middle class.

Obama is doing nothing more than trying to prop up the Bush economy. He's spending billions more than Bush for what? To try and get us back to where we were before the economic collaspe.

We need to create an economy that forces people to save more money. That makes harder for people to borrow money. That makes it illegal for credit card companies to charge these rediculously high loan shark rates. To force healthcare companies to cover ALL medical conditions.

We must lower taxes on corporations and small businesses so they can create more jobs. We need a pay for performance policy for CEO's. No more millions of dollars going to CEO's that ruin corporations.

clarification: one in ten of those with mortgages; those renting or own their homes not included.

After reading Professor Galbraith's article and a bunch or these blogs, it seems to me that the most obvious and fundamental economic problem never gets addressed in any of these discussions. The producer, who in the vast majority of cases is also the consumer, only gets paid a fraction of the value he produces in a working day and so overall, the mass of goods and services produced can never be purchased by the mass of consumers. This leads to a surplus of goods and services in the marketplace. For several generations the governing powers (and here I don't mean government) have sought to forestall a major depression through the continuous expansion of consumer credit so people were continuing to purchase today with money they had not yet earned. Meanwhile the portion of the value that the wage earners are not paid is converted into capital, resulting in the continuous expansion of capital looking for profitable investment. This results in the both an unnecessary expansion of production, and inflation of real estate, and all kinds of "exotic" investment schemes to try and produce something from nothing. The inflation of real estate has allowed the middle level wage earner to keep converting his consumer debt into mortgage debt through refinancing to extend the consumer market for a while longer. Several recent developments have intensified the gap between the value of goods produced and the purchasing power of the consumer market. The formost is exporting production to low wage countries. Market surpluses have cycled repeatedly for a couple of hundred years, however if, for example, a factory worker making $10 an hour and producing $15 an hour worth of goods is replaced by a factory worker making 20 cents an hour and producing $15 an hour worth of goods, overall buying power of the consumer base is reduced dramatically. Also the change in bankruptcy law that no longer allows the average consumer to dump his debt and start over has played a role in stifling consumer spending. The market slow down began a year before the credit collapse. Wars and military spending exacerbate fiscal and social problems, but the fundamental problem is still the inner conflict of capital that regards labor as overhead, and so forces the price down, while needing a constantly expanding consumer market to convert it’s products into new capital. However it is as we all tell our children; you can’t have your cake and it it too.

I agree with the main points but wish to offer some additional thoughts. Spending should be in human infrastructure. We are expecting a bulge in older population, with insufficient resources to respond. In addition to the smart suggestion to create re-training universities for green industries we need to develop more geriatricians, nurses, and community health clinics. Large urban-based hospitals can't do the work alone, and have come under the control of insurance companies mostly focused on cost savings, not life savings.
In addition, our population has centered in too few locations, causing housing and life needs to become too expensive, limited, and stressful. We need to develop more 'urban-type' sites, with affordable housing, arts development, and college/ school opportunities for new job skills. This would be important also for security reasons, to spread out our population over multiple sites, not just concentrated. it would also enable small business development again, especially if the urban planning would provide protection of a sort for small businesses that invest in these locations.

This is a strategy that would be self-sustaining thereafter, and would create more jobs and revenue. Bridges and roads only provide for one time jobs.

Now that the orgy of living on borrowed money is closing we can look back again on a typical period of Republican rule.
Whilst, I certainly believe that the infrastructure needs attention, I believe that states who do not have an agreed budget should get nothing. In California a reasonable budget is on the table which the Republican Governor will not sign whilst he eyes Federal funds as a bailout.

Where on this list would something really big like gov't sponsored universal healthcare go?

Milton Friedman, Reaganomics, trickle down nothingness, and the whole Neocon-Fascist experiment IS DEAD! It has all been repudiated!

Long live John Maynard Keynes, Fiscal Stimulus, the New New Deal and doing right by WE THE PEOPLE!

what about simply mandating all mortgages
be cut to 5 percent? This would quickly put money into the hands of all homeowners, and would result in a spending
spike and new confidence among the core
of the middle class.