Joe the....Um....Whatever
| Thu Oct. 16, 2008 1:23 PM PDT
JOE THE....UM....WHATEVER....Chris Orr is agog at the attention conservatives are paying to supposed weathervane du jour Joe the Plumber:
Do not expect this ardor to be dampened by the facts that Wurzelbacher is not an independent, makes nowhere near the $250,000 that prompted his question to Obama, and is not, in fact, a licensed plumber.
Okay, but at least his name really is Joe, isn't it? That counts for something.
UPDATE: I was just kidding, but it turns out his name isn't Joe. It's Samuel. Sheesh. But I guess he goes by Joe.
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Comments
Actually, his name is Samuel, not Joe.
http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081016/NEWS09/81...
So Joe is a Republican who decided to try to put Obama on the spot by pretending to be someone he is not. He did something comparable to my approaching McCain and claiming that I have cancer and lost my job and employer-provided health insurance, and can't get affordable insurance because of my pre-existing condition, $5000 isn't going to do the trick, and I'm already on the verge of bankruptcy due to medical expenses. Why wouldn't I just present it as a hypothetical situation someone might be in if I weren't actually in that situation? Because IT'S NOT AS DRAMATIC! And McCain loves him some drama! and conflict! and anger!
Lying Republican "Joe" is just like his candidate for president.
He only makes $40,000. He's not a licensed plumber (but he plans to sit for the licensing exam soon and he works for a plumbing business).
He is a flat tax believer.
There is also a discrepancy between the spelling of his name on his voter registration and his driver's license. He better hope he isn't disenfranchised by the GOP's voter fraud hysteria unit.
Submitted by skippy (not verified) on Thu Oct. 16, 2008 1:39 PM PDT.
breaking!
gop hospitalized w/broken pelvis!
Maybe he's "Joe the Plumber's Helper." If he doesn't pay his taxes, he'll end up "Plumber in the can." He probably specializes in clogged toilets, like with McCain's campaign. I wonder if he displays the "Plumber's crack" when he is at work. He is a Roto-Rooter for John McCain. He could use a little Draino.
As someone who comes from working class roots, I think this whole "Plumber Joe" thing sound a little like a particular kind of Broderism: a caricature created by elite politicians and pundits in order to show that they understand the "little guy"?
The whole thing just sounds corny. Based on my experience, plumbers do not refer to themselves as "Plumber Joe", just as guys who swing a hammer don't refer to themselves as "Builder Bob".
All of this sounds really demeaning and corny.
There's also an interesting connection with Charles Keating, as "Joe's" father Robert Wurzelbacher is Keating's son-in-law and spent 40 months in prison for his part in the Lincoln Savings scandal. This according to
this Robert Elisberg entry at Huffington Post.
Politico.com had a link up this morning that indicated that someone had checked the voter rolls in Ohio and Joe the Plumber wasn't even registered to vote!
http://www.politico.com/blogd/bensmith/1008/The_Joe_file.html
The link doesn't work anymore, but I'm guessing it has something to do with the confidentiality of the voter rolls rather than the fact Joe hadn't bothered to register to vote yet.
I'm sure the little elves at the RNC worked dutifully today to get Joe registered!
Robert J. Elisberg claims in a piece up at the Huffington Post that Joe the Plumber's father is Robert Wurzelbacher, Charles Keating's son-in-law and a former executive in Keating's holding company. Wurzelbacher served 40 months for "misapplying $14 million" while working for Lincoln Saving's holding company, American Continental Corporation. (Sorry, first comment, don't know how to include a link.)
This smells like more McCain scripted drama, rather than "Joe the Plumber Six Pack" coincidentaly showing up at this time. Another desperate act by McPalin. Don't be surprised if Joe starts showing up on the campaign stumps with McCain.
Submitted by Lee A. Arnold (not verified) on Thu Oct. 16, 2008 2:28 PM PDT.
Josh Marshal has a video link in which Joe the Plumber says "Social Security is a joke." I want you to know, not all plumbers feel that way. Including me:
The funniest part is, why a plumber? Plumbers are at the elite level of trades. Only Electricians and Refrigeration Mechs are even in the same league.
Good Journeymen operating their own firms can expect to earn more than most architects, lawyers, GP physicians...
...Plumbers are NOT the little guy, by a very long shot.
I ought to know: I am one.
Re Joe the Plumber
Let me get this straight.
1) His name ISN'T Joe? It's Samuel.
2) He's not a plumber. What does he do?
3) He's not from Ohio? He's from Florida.
4) He's not an Independent? He's a Republican.
5) He's not just some guy? He's actually the son of Charles Keating's son-in-law.
Oh, okay. That sounds fine. No weirdness there. Okey dokey.
The first time I heard of Joe the Plumber I immediately thought McCain had hired the guy to help do a hatchet (and scalpel) job on Obama.
Isn't the Internet wonderful!
Now that Joe the Plumber is the new media darling, I haven't heard much about Sarah Palin for a blissful 12 hours. I assume this is intentional on the part of the McCain campaign who realize, finally, that they made a mistake in choosing her.
Submitted by e henry thripshaw (not verified) on Thu Oct. 16, 2008 3:33 PM PDT.
Joe is quite right to worry what will happen to him if he earns over 250k per year.
I could use some of that worry.
and an addendum: Joe is quite right to worry what will happen to him if he earns over 250k per year. He is quite likely to do so, with hard work and business savvy. Plumbing is extremely lucrative for sole proprietors
Posted by: charles parr on 10/16/08 at 5:50 PM Respond
you mean to say that he can expect to clear 250k taxable business profit? do you need an apprentice?
Even if Joe da Plummah (He's the man I adore. He had the noive to tell me he's been married before! . . . Aaach!) pulls $250k of *taxable* income, he STILL WON'T MAKE ENOUGH TO JUSTIFY BEING A REPUBLICAN!
Why? Why? Why? Why do people think the GOP is looking out for their interests?
The guy claims he's thinking of buying business that will bring in over 250k per year.
But unless Joe has the couple million he'd need to buy such a business, he'll be paying a big chunk of change in interest to the bank for the funds to buy the business.
So unless he has the couple million in the bank (in which case he can afford higher taxes) Joe's income from the business will be vastly reduced by his interest expense, which he gets to deduct from the gross proceeds of his business before he has to pay taxes on it. He won't be *clearing* anything like 250k in that case, so he still won't fall into the category of over-250k income that he's talking about.
If all you had to do to *clear* that kind of dough was to buy a business, everyone would do it.
People just don't understand how taxation, or even basic finance, works.
Or they do, and they just lie about it.
Like the GOP idea that higher *personal* income tax rates prevents small-business owners from creating jobs. If you hire someone in your business, their wage is an EXPENSE that you deduct from the gross proceeds of your business. It is TAX FREE! In fact, when personal income-tax rates are high, that actually *encourages* small-business owners to plow money back into their businesses, whether by investment in equipment, hiring of more staff, or any other BUSINESS EXPENSE that can be deducted from gross proceeds, biding their time until taking money out of their business--and having to declare it as personal income--is less costly in tax terms.
Sheesh.
Taking Joe's story at face value, he told Senator Obama that the business would have an income of $250K to $280K. Obama explained that there would be a new tax break on medical benefits, and no increase on the first $250K, and a 3% increase, from 36% to 39%, on income over $250K. If this business really spins off $280K taxable income each year, Obama's tax increase is 3% of ($280K - $250K) = 3% of 30K = $900.
So Senator McCain felt it necessary to drag Joe the Plumber into the presidential debate over at most a $900 tax increase on a business turning an annual $280,000 profit, and he seriously claims that this $900 tax increase somehow has a significant impact on job creation? And even this $900 tax increase would be offset, perhaps entirely, but Obama's tax break on medical benefits. McCain's argument cannot be taken seriously; the whole Joe the Plumber business is absurd from top to bottom.
Also, this guy is undecided? A white non-college male who hates social security, believes in trickle-down economics, compares Obama to Sammy Davis Jr., and he's not a lock for McCain???
This is like Obama losing a minister who runs a shelter for homeless Katrina survivors.
Wow. Do any of you actually know anything about earning a living in a dirty career? the man did not approach the Messiah, he was addressed by him, and then had the audacity to ask a question that he thought might apply to him in the near future. I wonder...how many of you on this blog employ anyone? Do you pay payrolls? Do you pay for maintenance of all that is necessary to run a business? I also wonder how many of you heroes would like your past paraded out for all to see simply because you asked some politco a question...and I wonder how many of you heroes would ask the hard questions when it might mean getting prosecuted for asking those questions.
I suspect none of you would be willing to go to jail for your beliefs...you would just be willing to send others to jail for their beliefs.
Kevin S
