Chart of the Day
This isn't any big surprise or anything, but it's still sort of breathtaking when you see it in such stark terms. Via Steve Benen (from a Research 2000 poll), the Republican Party is just flat dead everywhere outside the South. Even folks in the Midwest can't stand them. The GOP is, for the time being anyway, a purely regional party.
And who's responsible for that? "I know this probably sounds arrogant to say," George Bush told speechwriter Matt Latimer in a conversation last year, "but I redefined the Republican Party." I'd say he had a point.
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Comments
Old Zell Miller was 180 degrees wrong
As I said on PoliticalAnimal, what I love is that turncoat Zell Miller had things exactly backwards when he said the Democrats were a "national party no more".
Daryl McCullough
Ithaca, NY
Very nicely played.
Very nicely played.
Couldn't we have freed the
Couldn't we have freed the slaves after the civil war and then let the south secede minus slaves?
Wouldn't everyone be way happier?
Well, I certainly wouldn't.
Well, I certainly wouldn't.
Not surprising, as the party
Not surprising, as the party seems to be led by a bunch of retarded miscreants, but I don't think this really does anything for your side either. Post the same survey regarding the Democratic party and I bet you get nearly identical results (but shift the love from the South to the Northeast).
You'd lose that bet.
You'd lose that bet.
Well, you're right actually,
Well, you're right actually, at least according to wherever these data came from. (The Dem info is buried in the link)
I find it highly amusing that there is substantially higher support for the Democratic party, in light of this recent Gallup poll (http://www.gallup.com/poll/123011/Parties-Congress-Near-Record-Low-Appro...), which shows only 36% of Americans approve of the job Democrats are doing in Congress (27% for Repubs).
Why this big disconnect between the party itself, and the members of the party? It seems to me to be pretty telling people keep voting for ideals that they know won't be fulfilled by the individuals they elect.
good question
I've always wondered about that.
For me personally, I've been a Democrat my whole life and my annoyance with the Democratic party started in about 1994 and hasn't gone away. To me, they act like a party in a defensive crouch, one afraid to offend and state boldly what they want. Pelosi is better than Reed in this respect, but neither one is Tip O'Neill, who simply fought for what he believed in. Or the congressional Democratic leadership when George H. W. Bush was president, who completely outmaneuvered him on taxes, which was both good policy and good politics.
In contrast, Harry Reid couldn't scare a fly off a counter. I never voted for Reagan or Bush, but I can think of several occasions when they cheerfully told someone to go fuck themselves, using appropriate presidential language. That's the kind of Democratic leadership we need. Perhaps Obama will be able to conjure one up in Congress, but I am not hopeful.
To pose the obvious
To pose the obvious question,then: why are the Democrats moving heaven and earth to please the Republicans?
You guys are whistling past
You guys are whistling past the graveyard again
http://www.nationaljournal.com/njmagazine/cookreport.php
Blue-state Democrats are showing little awareness that their party has a problem.
I am becoming convinced, based on this and other research, that although many independent voters are disappointed in specific things that Obama has done, they still hope that he will do well and believe that he might. To be sure, red America has already given Obama the thumbs down. And blue America just wishes he would be more liberal. But it's purple America, the independents who voted for Democrats in the 2006 midterm election by an 18-point margin, that makes the biggest difference right now. Most House Democrats live in blue America and show little awareness that their party has a problem. However, the Democrats' majority is built on a layer of 54 seats that the party picked up in 2006 and 2008 that are largely in purple -- or even red -- America. Democrats ought to keep in mind that 84 of their current House members represent districts won by President Bush in 2004 or John McCain in 2008.
A whopping 48 of those Democrats -- eight more than the size of their party's majority -- are from districts that voted for both Bush and McCain. That America is very different from the Democratic base in blue America, and it sees many major issues very differently.
Resurgent Republic's findings corroborate a growing view that the cumulative impact of Democratic missteps has reached a critical mass, with Obama receiving some damage and with Democrats in Congress and the Democratic Party receiving much more. Critics point to the Troubled Asset Relief Program; the takeovers of banks and auto companies; an economic stimulus package that they see as ineffectual and stuffed with pork; and climate-change and health care reform efforts as all being contributing factors to Democrats' decline.
The 17-point advantage that Democrats enjoyed in the January Gallup Poll (when "leaners" were included) shrank to 5 points in August. Their edge on the generic congressional ballot test has vanished, according to most national polls. For three years, Democrats enjoyed high single-digit or low double-digit leads on this question -- a very good indicator of which direction (and how hard) the political winds are blowing as a congressional election nears.
What we are seeing is an electorate growing just as disgusted with the Democratic majority as it did with the Republican one in 2006. The mounting ethics problems of House Ways and Means Committee Chairman Charles Rangel, D-N.Y., combined with ongoing allegations about House Defense Appropriations Subcommittee Chairman John Murtha, D-Pa., and others on his panel threaten to make matters still worse for their party.
So what evidence can you
So what evidence can you provide for all this other research? All the polls agree that GOP party ID has been flat-lining for a year at around 20-21%. Where in all this do you find hope for Republicans?
Alabama [et al] You got the
Alabama [et al]
You got the rest of the union
to help you along.
What's going wrong?
"What we are seeing is an
"What we are seeing is an electorate growing just as disgusted with the Democratic majority as it did with the Republican one in 2006. "
Congressional Democrats have a net favorability of -17. This isn't great. Favorability ratings of Democrats have started to recover after Obama's speech showed Dems weren't completely emasculated.
Congressional GOP favorability is, by contrast, -51. If we're whistling past the graveyard, you guys are thinking "I can hardly taste the cyanide" as you gulp down the Kool-Aid.
Most disturbing for
Most disturbing for Republicans is the Midwest figure. The Midwest used to either be a GOP stronghold or a 50/50 bellweather. True, these numbers could change in an instant, but I think this chart is evidence that even as Americans become disillusioned with Obama, they have yet to flock to the Republican banner. You can add up the numbers any way you want, without significant support in the West and Midwest there's no way you're returning to power.
As a former Ohio resident, I always thought the Iraq war was the trigger which caused many red cultural voters in the Midwest to shift towards the Democratic party. But what's becoming increasingly clear is that the economic issues are keeping them there. So many people in the Great Lakes region think their government sold them down the river...and though that used to be a bipartisan discontentment, the GOP's recent stand against the auto companies has solidified them as the bad guys in this struggle. I knew a lot of people in Ohio who thought Republican leaders had lost their minds when it came to that.
isn't so great for the Democrats, either
This isn't so great for the Democrats, either.
It means we have one serious party and anyone who is serious has to default to the Democrats or go nowhere or be an idiot.
Perhaps that's too big a tent. Legislation threatens to compromise to a soft, squishy agreeableness that isn't one thing and it isn't another thing, it's just sort of inoffensive.
Things change. Bush had a
Things change. Bush had a 92% approval rating at one time. Obama's ratings are in steep decline--will probably hit about 3% by 2012 (estimated).
Bush benefited from crisis
Bush's 92% approval was anomalous. It really reflected country solidarity in the aftermath of 9/11. For a brief moment in history, Americans were united as victims. It wasn't particularly to Bush's credit, but as the leader of America he benefited from the unity we all felt.
The biggest reason that I detested Bush was how he squandered and betrayed that moment of unity. Rather than using the opportunity to work for the good of America, he cynically used it to further his own pet projects, including taking out Saddam Hussein, and defeating Democrats in the 2002/2004 elections.
Daryl McCullough
Ithaca, NY
Exactly right
I don't usually bother to post a comment just to say "you're right" but this has always been what I despised most about Bush, too.
He squandered our moment of unity
He squandered the world's goodwill
He squandered the lives of thousands of young Americans who, in the wave of patriotism following 9/11, enlisted in the military to fight our real enemies, not Bush's vanity war.
There is not a room in Hell hot enough for that man.
Bush, as usual, is taking too much credit.
He'd like to think he was the decider on this, too, but I think not so much. The policy and political decisions that have brought the GOP to where they deservedly belong were made by plenty of others, but not him. He was just there to swagger, squint and smirk.
92% - ha
Yep, 92% of Americans supported George W. Bush in the aftermath of his greatest failure - which was kind of stupid, but shows that Democrats are far more patriotic than Republicans. But look at his approval numbers over time. What you saw was a nice sawtooth waveform on an ever decreasing slope. Why? Because the Republicans are brilliant at games. But the more people are exposed to the reality of Republicans the worse they look.
What the defenders can't seem to understand is that there will be no Iraq war and there will be no Katrina. The problem with supporting a party that hates government is that there is no chance that such a party can govern. Bush didn't take the Republican Party anywhere it wasn't already going.
One day there will be a rational alternative to the Democratic Party. It's not clear if that party will use the name Republican.
There's a difference between
There's a difference between "supporting the President" and approving of the job he's doing. The former is more nebulous, and, with the President as the head of state as well as the head of government, it's easy for patriotism to bleed into supporting the head of state. I for one support Queen Elizabeth (despite not being a Commonwealth subject), but I'm neutral on the job she's doing because she doesn't have much of a job.
Not sure how valid the
Not sure how valid the source of this data is.
I use Rasmussen at http://www.rasmussenreports.com.
He polls "those most likely to vote" which is what matters most. You will find some very good supporting data regarding Obama trends as well as an ongoing Rep/Dem support number. The past few months Rep support has outpaced Dem. This makes me really wonder about the data above.
If I had to pick one, I would definetly go with Rasmussen who was very accurated in the past two elections.
I like all the big red middle fingers
Take that, GOP!
Southern Man
Neil Young hit the nail on the head 35 years ago.
Anti-egalitarian slaveholders wanted to rule blacks AND non-slaveholders. Jeffersonian democracy always meant elites were superior and should be deferred to.
The result was that yeoman farmers etc. had to content themselves with the political crumbs and the 'comforting' fact that "at least I ain't a slave" . The result is the Southern GOP keeps saying "Look, a black man!" The lower and middle class whites continue to vote against their own economic interests. The problem is that northern torpor results in more Dems moving South. ( I was 35 years in Rochester, NY. Last four years in Atlanta). Just as antebellum Deep South slave owners worried about slaves bleeding out of the Border South and reducing their political weight, the inverse is happening demographically.
And Yet
the false doctrine of ideological balance requires that media give equal time to the Republicans.
so sad
the media coverage of health care makes me sick. Sure let's run footage of crazy people at town halls. Or let's interview the founder of a GOP funded PAC who is having a "grassroots" tea party o a bus.
How about interviewing doctors??????? Hospital administators? Insurance company workers?????
Oh, you mean physicians like
Oh, you mean physicians like this one
http://lonestartimes.com/2009/08/13/obama-camp-plants-fake-doc-che-fan-a...
Obama Camp Plants Fake Doc Che Fan at Jackson Lee Forum
In this video, Mayer claims to be a general practitioner, eliciting applause and even a hug from Queen Sheila:
I’m not sure why, but something didn’t smell right. So my colleagues and I did a little digging, and wouldn’t you know it? Roxana Mayer is, like, totally not a doctor.
But she is an Obama campaign volunteer.
Our own David Jennings secured a phone interview, in which Mayer admitted to impersonating a physician, saying — get this — she thought it would help her credibility. (It didn’t.)
You know what this means:
You know what this means: we have to let Olympia Snowe and Chuck Grassley help write health care legislation.
More polls that debunk this one...
Steve Benen... wonder what his agenda is?
His data is contradicted by every reputable pollster out there. If you don't like Rasmussen... check out all the various polls listed at realpolitics.com, including PEW, which is very much a liberal organization.
The "generic ballot" polls show the distance between Democrats and Republicans at basically even given the +/- variable.
Given that, how can the bar chart above be accurate?
Check out the current races... very much leaning in favor of Republican candidates.
MotherJones should check things out before letting its authors post poop.
Polls and self-deception
Barry,
The poll that Kevin posted is correct. Look at a breakdown of 2008 elections. In Georgia, Saxby Chambliss had to beat a virtual unknown in a runoff to be REELECTED. Homo Sapiens exhibit a very well documented need for self-deception. We look at all the evidence that backs OUR position and shrug off all negative inferences as noise.
Read the graph...
Read the graph, read the article, read the graph author's link, read the Research 2000 reference. I see nothing about 2008 elections.
I have no idea regarding Research 2000's agenda or how they worded their survey. The bottom line is current data from most reliable polling firms shows that both major parties are evenly viewed and Obama's numbers are tanking.
Why? The great orator - as long as he has a teleprompter - is showing his true colors and he is not the person Independents vote for. Of course, anyone who did their homework on Obama's background is not surprised. It is a lesson in good public sales strategy that a person raised on the far left fringe with know radical associates, a friend of ACORN and radical ministers, who appoints Socialists and Communists to his Czarist positions, who was one of the most liberal voters in the US Senate, could be be passed as a centrist. My God, people...tigers don't change their stripes. Why are you surprised? But I digress...
Who is suffering self-deception here?
Kevin and other Dems are
Kevin and other Dems are busy falling into the trap the Republicans did from 2005 onwards - only believing polls that reinforce their prejudices. Neither of these articles I've cited are written by right wing journalists, by the way
http://www.nationaljournal.com/njmagazine/nj_20090919_2367.php
Dems Lose Footing In The Mountain West
Amid a fierce backlash, western Democrats risk being forced to give back some of their recent gains.
Now, however, amid a fierce conservative backlash against President Obama's agenda, Democrats face an escalating challenge to defend those advances in 2010. All signs show the momentum shifting toward Republicans in a region that has traditionally resisted the sort of assertive federal initiatives that Obama has offered on issues from the economic stimulus to health care. "Here in the West, there is a really strong concern about overly intrusive government policies," said Nicole McCleskey, a New Mexico-based Republican pollster. "I think there's a sense that maybe we overcorrected a little in the last election, we maybe went too far to that [Democratic] side, and now we are seeing the bounce-back."
But the unease in these states about Obama's first months, unease that echoes his party's difficulties here during Bill Clinton's presidency, raises questions about Democrats' ability to maintain their support in the Mountain West while pursuing a national agenda that inflames the region's historic suspicion of Washington.
This Nicole McCleskey?
http://www.pos.org/about/mccleskey.asp
"Public Opinion Strategies".
You don't suppose one of those strategies is planting ideas in ostensibly non-partisan articles, do you?
From her Google results, she's most certainly supporting Republicans, in addition to being one.
This Nicole
This Nicole McCleskey?
Submitted by kenga (not verified) on September 21, 2009 - 1:05pm.
http://www.pos.org/about/mccleskey.asp
"Public Opinion Strategies".
You don't suppose one of those strategies is planting ideas in ostensibly non-partisan articles, do you?
From her Google results, she's most certainly supporting Republicans, in addition to being one.
=====================================================
Quoted as one of many sources in an article written by Ron Brownstein, a political editor at National Journal. Please work on your reading comprehension
Whaddya mean "even folks in the Midwest"?
Lousy coastal elites - don't you know the progressive movement was born and bred in the Midwest? Look at the numbers, Kevin. We Midwesterners have approve less and disapprove more of the Republican Party than those folks in the West, and for all your Utahs and Wyomings we have South Dakotas, Kansases, and Oklahomas. Come to Minnesota some time, Kevin. Even if the weather's not great, you'll find yourself right at home politically.
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