Clinton Bashes Obama's Weathermen Connection, But What About Her Own?
| Thu Apr. 17, 2008 8:25 AM PDT
"I wish you could conduct a campaign on policy and policy differentiation," Howard Wolfson, Senator Hillary Clinton's campaign communications director, said in a conference call with reporters on Thursday morning. He added that Clinton "would like nothing more."
This was moments after Wolfson and Phil Singer, another top Clinton aide, had hammered Barack Obama for having held a fundraiser during his first state senate campaign in Illinois at the home of William Ayers, a professor of education at the University of Illinois and a former aide to Chicago Mayor Richard Daley, who was a member of the radical Weather Underground Organization, which was responsible for several bombings in the early 1970s. Ayers was never arrested for his activities. But in 2001, he did say, "I don't regret setting bombs." The issue had come up during the previous night's debate. Responding to a question about Ayers, Obama had said, "the notion that somehow as a consequence of me knowing somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago when I was 8 years old, somehow reflects on me and my values, doesn't make much sense." Wolfson, this morning after, insisted that Obama had "to be more forthcoming about that issue" and state clearly whether it had been "appropriate" to attend a fundraiser at Ayers' home.
When it came time for questions for Wolfson, I asked an obvious one: Did Hillary Clinton believe that it had been appropriate in 2001 for President Bill Clinton to have pardoned two members of the Weather Underground as he left office? The two recipients of Clinton's munificence were Linda Evans, who was sentenced to five years in prison for her participation in a string of 1980s bombings, and Susan Rosenberg, who was charged with participating in a bank robbery that left one guard and two police officers dead. And, I continued, has Senator Clinton ever criticized this decision? Has she ever said anything publicly about it? Rosenberg, I noted, had been apprehended with 740 pounds of explosives in her possession.
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Wolfson replied, "I am not aware of Linda Evans or Susan Rosenberg...hosting a political event for Senator Clinton."
I interrupted to note that I had not asked whether they had. I had asked whether Clinton had supported or opposed her husband's pardons for these two women. (I resisted the urge to throw in Marc Rich.)
Wolfson responded that while I have the right to ask questions the way I see fit, he has the right to answer them in the manner he chooses--and then I can evaluate his reply. (Given that the Clinton aides do take many questions from all comers, I could not argue with him on that.) Wolfson went on to accuse the Obama campaign of trying to conflate the pardons and the Ayers issues. And indeed it is. The Obama campaign did disseminate email about the Weather Underground radicals pardoned by Bill Clinton. Wolfson then maintained the critical difference here is that Ayers had been a "key supporter" of Obama.
I tried again: the question is whether Senator Clinton believes the pardons for Rosenberg and Evans were appropriate. Wolfson replied "I am not an expert on the pardons....I don't know what she said" about them.
Could he find out and get back to us? Yes, he said.
During the call, Wolfson said, "voters deserve as much information about the candidates as possible." And Clinton's view of the Weather Underground pardons, given her campaign's effort to pump up the volume of the Ayers matter, certainly meets that standard.
By the way, Wolfson added that neither Linda Evans or Susan Rosenberg had ever hosted an event for Senator Clinton--just in case any of the reporters had missed that point. He added that Clinton had not raised the issue at the debate on Wednesday night. True, but now her campaign had--and it was signalling it would keep doing so, as part of an effort to tie Obama to a "terrorist." The ploy was a clear one. In this instance, you don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.
Comments
Submitted by capt - Hussein (not verified) on Thu Apr. 17, 2008 8:49 AM PDT.
Let HRC and her camp do all they want - it isn't working now and it will only hurt her numbers. It is so over. . .
Great piece!
Obama seems to think he can dismiss associations with nefarious characters simply by being unaware of their inflammatory rhetoric.
He may well surf that wave all the way, but more likely a shark will pluck him off his board before Denver.
Again, Ayers was not a terrorist by any definition of the word I know of. It's bad enough that this ridiculous "connection" is being discussed in this campaign at all (which, by the way, goes well beyond what the McCarthyites did in the 50s, which is saying something), without accepting the premise of people like Sean Hannity and WorldNetDaily. Terrorism is political activity aimed at civilians designed to harm or engender fear (hence, "terror"). That's not what Ayers claims he did forty years ago.
Bottom line here is: This campaign has gone on far too long. If it contin ues much longer, we might as well annoint John McCain in November before the convention. What the Supers fail to see is how Hillary will continue to play "McCain" and damage any Democratic candidate in the fall. I think they think they should wait to weigh in on this until July............that;s far too long to let her continue her attack and give ammunition to McCain. If you want to win in November, need to stop all this in-fighting now or losing Hillary supporters won't matter, because we'll lose anyway.
"Guilt by association" doesn't fly these days. If we all stayed away from anyone who did something wrong in their lives, or said something stupid, we'd all live in a bubble. Get real...if you want to claim yourself perfect, go ahead, but we know better.
Those of us who are grown ups ( which eliminates most Obama followers) are getting a little tired of your whining.we know this is what Obama does best when he gets hit with some truth he's not prepared to duck, but this. "what about Clinton's?" infantile whining is getting too much. do everyone a favor and take your thumb out of your mouth.
Submitted by capt - Hussein (not verified) on Thu Apr. 17, 2008 10:17 AM PDT.
Hillary Clinton and her surrogates have petulantly claimed that the reason why she should stick around after it's clear that there's no way she'll overcome Barack Obama's lead among pledged delegates is that the superdelegates could decide to go with her instead of Obama. The superdelegates' rationale for doing so would presumably need to be based on questions of electability. Hillary Clinton, in the exchange quoted above, said there is no electability argument that can be used against Barack Obama.
The voters have demonstrated a clear preference for Barack Obama over Hillary Clinton. She cannot overcome his lead. Hillary Clinton acknowledges that Barack Obama can beat John McCain. Thus, she's lost, and she has no argument that it's a threat to Democrats to have Barack Obama as our nominee. Therefore, there's no reason for Hillary Clinton to continue her campaign.
Its so obvious what Hills wants to do in this campaign. She'll make sure Obama does not win so she can say -told ya- and than make another run in 2012. She's sticking around not because she thinks she can win but because she does not want Obama to win in November.
Bill isn't running for President, Hillary is. And how is it that posters here can say "guilt by association doesn't fly anymore" re: Obama and in the next breath smear Hillary with "guilt by association." Grow up -- pardoning 2 people who served jail time & repented is different from being "friendly" with a guy whose rich daddy got him off and who shows no remorse. If the Obama camp thinks last night was harsh, they will all have strokes in the GE.
No, they didn't hold political evens for Clinton, but allowing someone to host a political event for you doesn't equate to sympathizing with their cause or their problems. A fundraiser is a fundraiser, and Ayers only gave Obama $200 of his own money. It doesn't sound to me like they were "of like mind."
However, commuting the sentences of two people who were serving the punishment meted out to them by the American judicial system...wow. Now, that says "sympathy." That says "personal interest."
Now tell me, which is worse?
No, they didn't hold political events for Clinton, but allowing someone to host a political event for you doesn't equate to sympathizing with their cause or their problems. A fundraiser is a fundraiser, and Ayers only gave Obama $200 of his own money. It doesn't sound to me like they were "of like mind."
However, commuting the sentences of two people who were serving the punishment meted out to them by the American judicial system...wow. Now, that says "sympathy." That says "personal interest."
Now tell me, which is worse?
First of All the two individuals that were pardoned were in jail doing their time, and neither of them made dispariging remarks after 9/11, Ayers never did any time and he made those horrible remarks after 911 there is a difference and secondly, Bill Clinton Pardoned those individuals not Hillary, so how are we going to do this, either she gets credit for everything the good and the bad or she gets credit for nothing, you decide, but you cannot have it both ways. now what?
Hillary's defense of her NAFTA position hinges on the fact that, while Bill was president, she tried to talk him out of it, and that she personally did not support it. Now tell me that her opinion about the commuting of these sentences has no bearing. Hillary can't have it both ways. Either her actions during Bill's presidency count, or they don't. She can't keep cherry-picking.
Exactly. They were in jail, doing their time. Why did Bill feel the need to commute their sentences? As far as I know, Ayers wasn't responsible for killing anyone. He also made his way through the American judicial system. He is a free man. And is 9/11 supposed to be the barometer for every single utterance made since then? Dont' be naive. Obama isn't responsible for something Ayers said. I guess Mayer Daly, for whom Ayers was an aide, and Sen. Alice Palmer, who was the one who introduced Ayers and Obama as she prepared to step down from her senate seat, have no problem with Ayers. I guess they're crazy radicals, too, eh?
Why are we even talking about Hillary anymore, except to tell her to go away. She is bad news and has no chance. That anyone is still harping on about what she says or does seems to me a gigantic waste of time - as she is irrelevant, as she should be.
The only level on which she matters is her sociopathic desire to take down the inevitable nominee by using millions of democratic dollars. For that she should be deplored, even by her supporters.
She is and has always been a bad candidate, and those of you in her corner have confused static intelligence (memorizing facts and figures) with dynamic intelligence (actually solving problems, leading people, etc...). You have also confused insane rageful determination to win at all costs with character and steeliness.
In about 5 weeks she will be officially done. If Obama loses for any reason in November, I'd say we can all look to her as a major contributor to that loss. Though I think - despite her efforts - that's unlikely to happen.
To Kim:
"either she gets credit for everything the good and the bad or she gets credit for nothing, you decide, but you cannot have it both ways. now what?"
Well, most of her claimed experience is being "first lady" and she wants that to count, so yes, this counts. If this doesn't count, then her claimed experience doesn't count, you decide.
Submitted by JACKIE MONTILEONE (not verified) on Thu Apr. 17, 2008 11:24 AM PDT.
THIS IS THE REASON SHE IS STAYING IN THIS RACE, SHE KNOWS SHE CANNOT WIN BUT SHE DOES NOT WANT OBAMA TO WIN SO SHE CAN RUN FOR PRES. IN 2012. SHE IS A TRIP...ANYTHING BEYOND THAT SHE WILL BE TOO OLD LIKE MCCAIN....
Wolfson is a total, bumbling idiot. He should check his facts before he starts frothing at the mouth.
First of all, Obama did not attend a "fundraiser" at Ayers' house. In 1995, the then-outgoing congresswoman of that Chicago district brought Obama to the Ayers house to introduce him as her successor. They were apparently making the rounds to some of the more prominent Democrats in the district.
Next, Ayers was never a "key" Obama supporter. He donated $200 to Obama's state senate campaign. That's it.
The Clinton campaign is worse than the Republicans. They are just trash. I can't wait until this primary season is over.
First it was "oh, Obama isn't experienced enough", then it was "Obama is a Muslim", then Obama isn't black enough", then "Obama is too black", then "Obama has associations with terrorists", then "Obama doesn't have good Judgment", now "he's an elitist" - (despite the fact that he came from a broken, poor upbringing and spent years helping lowing and middle income people as a community organizer.)
What's next? "Oh, Obama is too every-man".
Yet the truth remains, the too black, not black enough, Muslim, inexperienced, lacking judgment candidate is ahead in delegates, popular vote and more states won.
[" He donated $200 to Obama's state senate campaign. That's it.']
Didn't take any more than that to turn Ron Paul into a charter member of Stormfront..., according to some who desperately wished it were true, because they feared he would succeed.
That's the psychology of "opperation smear campaign" for you.
Then there is also Hillary's college age defense of Black Panther Murders (they brutally killed one of their own, a suspected informant as reported on Amy Goodman's democracy now!) Those killers where were never prosecuted for their admitted crimes and were later appointed to high offices in the Clinton administration. For a Clinton hypocrisy knows no bounds.
I love Kim's assertion that "making disparaging remarks" is as bad as murdering police officers.
She gets credit for both the good and the bad: Passing Reagan's budgets, failing once to reform health care, then giving up and not bothering to try again for six long years in the White House, NAFTA, Welfare reform. Remind me which is the good part?
Hillary failed to pass health care reform, failed to stop NAFTA, failed to create jobs in upstate NY. Failure is not a resume.
Unfortunately for Obama facts are ugly things -
William Ayers was a founding member of the Weather Underground - The group was a violent anti war organization who's charter was the overthrow of the United States government. They bombed the Pentagon, the US Capitol and a number of NY City police stations.
William Ayers own girlfriend and 2 other members of the group were killed by a bomb they were building to use against military recruiters at Fort Dix. The group also killed 2 police officers and a security guard during a botched bank robbery-the purpose of which was to gain funds to further their terrorist activities.
William Ayers has never renounced his actions and to this day defends them and laments that the group had not done more. Look it up.
Obama knew exactly who this man was and yet chose to nurture a personal and professional relationship with him. I'm sorry, but someone aspiring to the Presidency of the US does not do that.
As for Obama comparison of his relationship to Ayers and Bill Clinton's pardoning of two of the groups members - it is absurd to equate the two - first of all Bill Clinton pardoned them, not Hillary - and second - the two women pardoned served nearly 2 decades in prison, renounced their past activities and swore an allegiance to the US to gain the pardon - a far cry from what Ayers has done.
Hey, Hillary fans, we have saying in Britain for idiots like you: Get Knotted!
You must all be drinking too much flouridated water and have lost your ability to reason. On the other hand, judging by the language in your various posts, you all appear to be some older spinster-types who have become emBITTERed at the prospect of not getting your gun-toting, beer-swilling, shot-slugging sister into the WH with her philandering appendage.
Submitted by chredon (not verified) on Thu Apr. 17, 2008 1:58 PM PDT.
Oh please! Can we talk about an ISSUE please? Gas prices? Iraq? Mortgages? Food prices? ANYTHING other than this constant stream of he said/she said?
Twenty years ago, I asked a staffer in Senator Jesse Helms' office to expidite a passport application for me. That doesn't make me a right-wing conservative. My father was a racist, and I lived under his roof for 18 years. That doesn't make me one. The way the media is handling this is madness. If I had to answer for the words and deeds of everyone I ever knew, anyone I ever worked with, anyone who ever showed me their support, the press would railroad me, too.
Anyone who gets to the level of running for President is going to have met and worked with a lot of people with whom they share little in the way of personal views. Just because you work with somebody or accept support from somebody, that doesn't mean that you support everything that THEY have ever done, or that you support all of the views that they hold. You can't hold any candidate to that kind of standard. Think about it - do YOU agree with everything everyone you know has ever said?
Can we talk about ISSUES now? PLEEEEASE?
If one lives in a big city and are publicly active, its inevitable that one crosses path with various elements both good and bad. Sometimes one becomes associated, quite innocently, with people who have a questionable past. This I believe is the case with Obama and Ayers. Whatever Ayers did, he was never prosecute for it, let alone serve time in the poky. So those infantile s*it-for-brains desperatly tring to make a connection between Obama and Ayers, are the ones with a nefarious purpose in mind (Sean Hannity is the specious miscreant that have benn muddying the water over this ridiculous smear). Take the current pope, Benedict, he was an Hilter Youth. Now, would you all like to ask the entire Catholic Churh membership to abandon that organization?
Submitted by Monte Asbury (not verified) on Thu Apr. 17, 2008 2:28 PM PDT.
Look at FactCheck.org for info on the Weather connection. Their conclusion is that it's nothing but casual contact between two people who knew people in Chicago. Will independent evaluation suffice, or shall we continue to insist that there's an issue here? "Lions and tigers and bears, Oh my!"
mdr
obama doesn't whine-hillary whines, in fact, she cries if the mean ole bullies are picking on her. not only does she whine, play the feminist card, panders to people with whom she has nothing in common[see shots of crown royal w/ beer chaser]... she lies and she lies a lot[see bosnia, irish peace accords, and on and on and on.
not to mention have you seen where she said, " screw those people bill."
those people would be the ordinary, common working man of the south.
have a nice day.
Submitted by Kaz (not verified) on Thu Apr. 17, 2008 4:22 PM PDT.
In last 7 years I did not miss many Sunday's program with George Stephanopoulos. After watching last night's debate, I dont think I will ever watch ABC again.
Well, I honestly don't see why one is tied in with the other. Is anyone actually asking what HRC thought of those pardons besides Clinton Haters?
Obama doesn't want to be guilty of any of his associations, but he wants Clinton to be guilty of all associations.
This guy (1) held a fundraiser for OBAMA, (2) has no remorse for his activities and in fact has said he didn't do enough, and (3) said pretty outrageous stuff after 9/11.
Did any Weathrepeople hold a fundraiser for Clinton?
Did the ones that Bill Clinton pardon express remorse? Did they make outrageous comments after 9/11?
Otherwise, why is the media questioning Clinton, when they should be questioning Ayers? Does he Stand by his comments? If so, that's a gigantic ISSUE.
Clinton connection...and it is not relevant when she attended church or shoot a gun but worried about Ayers;;;;Well
President Clinton pardoned to members of the Weatherman Underground ... and then she was all for going to commercial break.
What? Hillary? No comeback for that?
After Mrs. Clinton criticized Mr. Obama for not severing all Ayers ties, Mr. Obama said, "By Senator Clinton's own vetting standards, I don't think she would make it, since President Clinton pardoned or commuted the sentences of two members of the Weather Underground."
That referred to commutations by Mr. Clinton in January 2001, shortly before leaving office, for Linda Evans and Susan Rosenberg. Ms. Evans had been convicted of weapons and explosives charges connected with eight bombings in the mid-'80s and sentenced to 40 years in prison. Ms. Rosenberg had been charged in connection with a 1981 armed robbery in which two police officers and a security guard were killed, and was serving 58 years after being convicted of weapons charges in a 1984 case.
'60s Radicals Become Issue in Campaign of 2008
Can there be any stronger support for something than using your power to pardon?
In fact, the Clintons' support of members of this group should be viewed as much more significant than a member's (neighbor's) support of him.
I really hate that we are having this debate. I blame my senator. She couldn't contain her giddiness when this topic came up.
She did learn the wrong lesson from the years of pointless and cruel attacks on her. I guess it's true that the abused becomes the abuser.
The Clintons and their legacy suffer. McCain and the Republicans rejoice. This is the bottom of the barrell politics and the world thought we had finally started to come to our senses.
Clinton camp is trying to turn this Ayers thing into their "October Surprise" just days before the PA Primary.
Obama's team needs to get ahead of them on this message and stop being reactive with responses. Obama needs to control this in the media before it gets out of control like the Wright thing.
Congratulations! Maybe through the efforts of people like you we can really change politics in the future. Why doesn't anyone ask Wolfson why Hillary cannot win on the basis of her own merits rather than the dirt she can collect on someone else?
Great Mother Jones story here that's worth a re-read.
circa 1998 - Clinton
http://www.motherjones.com/news/outfront/1998/01/pritchard.html
If you thought last night was a "level" playing field, you need to lay off the crack pipe. Hillary's mission in life is to destroy Barack. If she does it now, she will earn the nomination. If she throws enough mud, but still loses, then she will at least have damaged him badly enough to hurt his chances in the general. That way, if he loses she can say "I told you so." She cares nothing about her party, only herself. I heard Bill saying today how he was tickled when Barack struggled with the attacks last night. If the situation was reversed, we would never have heard Michelle Obama say such a thing. The Clintons are evil, pure and simple.
"First of All the two individuals that were pardoned were in jail doing their time, and neither of them made dispariging remarks after 9/11, Ayers never did any time and he made those horrible remarks after 911 there is a difference"
That is misinformed. Its what hillary wants you to believe but its not true. The quotes from ayers that were "published" after 911 were from what he said long before 911. But that what you get when you have candidates twist the truth. And while we're on the topic of commuted sentences and terrorists lets not forget about the 16 puerto rican nationalists (FALN) that set off 120 bombs in the US and had their sentences commuted by clinton at the end of his term. These were also convicted terrorists. But we don't want to talk about that, instead we want to talk about how obama a professor in chicago has crossed paths with ayers a free man that is also a professor in the same community on a multi-member board that did alot of good for chicago and was not radical at all. In fact they only overlapped 3 of obamas 9 years on the commmitee. Give me a break. If you held everyone responsible for past actions or words of everyone they know then no person would ever be qualified to be present.
