Joe Wilson: Confederate Heritage Is "Honorable"
| Thu Sep. 10, 2009 2:44 PM PDT
Rep. Joe Wilson, the congressman who accused the President of lying last night during his address on health care to a joint session of Congress, isn’t just some mean-spirited buffoon. As a South Carolina legislator, he was one of only 7 state senators who fought to keep the confederate battle flag flying over the state capital. South Carolina, of course, was the first state to leave the Union after Lincoln was elected. Flying the confederate battle flag was a big deal in the south, which was once—and in some cases is still—inhabited by the KuKluxKlan and its successors. Here, via Kris Kromm’s excellent blog Facing South, is what happened when South Carolina's state legislature voted to take down the flag in the 1990s:
Advertisement
Advertisement
... then-Sen. Wilson did more than vote to keep [the flag]: he went so far as to appear to defend the Confederacy, declaring that "the Confederate heritage is very honorable." Here's the full quote from a BBC News report:
But local lawmakers, like Republican senator Joe Wilson say it is all about pride and history, and nothing to do with racism and hate. He finds comparisons with Nazis odious.
"That's offensive to me that they would take my heritage and make it into a Holocaust era type description. I find that very offensive, and it's not true," Senator Wilson said. "The Southern heritage, the Confederate heritage is very honourable."
The decision to fly the Confederate battle flag was made by an all-white legislature in 1962 as the civil rights movement was picking up steam. The bill passed in 2000 didn't even remove the flag entirely—it called for a different version of flag to be flown in front of the state house instead of on top of it.
The continued presence of a Confederate flag at the state house has caused the controversy to continue. In July 2009, the Atlantic Coast Conference—after discussions with the NAACP—decided to move three future college baseball tournaments out of South Carolina.
Comments
The Vietnam War was WRONG, RACIST and EVIL.
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Thu Sep. 10, 2009 4:41 PM PDT.
So, are you in favor of removing the Vietnam Memorial from the mall?
How about public shaming and or prison for veterans of the current WRONG, RACIST and EVIL wars we are fighting today instead of a Memorial?
Just curious to see if you are a HYPOCRITE.
Honor the warrior, not the
Submitted by BureauCat on Thu Sep. 10, 2009 6:40 PM PDT.
Honor the warrior, not the war.
Some of these crackers, well, crack me up. A friend came back from SC earlier this year with a $5 bill that was neatly rubber-stamped with a legend on top of Abraham Lincoln's face. The rubber stamp said, "Northern Terrorist". That's a President of the United States, and it is 144 years after that particular war was lost. There are people who are still rabidly angry that "the War of Northern Aggression" took their slaves away -- but can only express it by doing things like displaying the Confederate flag. And today we have a black man in the White House.
Yes, although you can argue
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Thu Sep. 10, 2009 5:49 PM PDT.
Yes, although you can argue that the Vietnam War was wrong, racist, and evil, a war memorial is a tribute to fallen soldiers. A flag is not a tribute to fallen soldiers. You're comparing apples and oranges. It doesn't make someone a hypocrite if they don't agree with your assessment.
Uh, lemme see if'n I get
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Thu Sep. 10, 2009 6:49 PM PDT.
Uh, lemme see if'n I get this straight...
Ron "You Lie" Wilson is somehow bad cuz he spoke the truth when Obama lied on illegals not getting freebie healthcare (Ga Sen Nathan Deal's bill to have proof of citizenship provided for healthcare was defeated by democrats so now no eligibility requirement stands) and to further beat him up we turn to his defense of Confederate Heritage...
Dwight D Eisenhower had a picture of General Lee in his Oval Office. Jimmy Carter pardoned Lee. Democrat James Webb wrote an eloquent book in defense of the Confederate Soldier "Born Fighting". Teddy Roosevelt said Lee was the greatest soldier ever in America. Woodrow Wilson put the Confederate Memorial Statue in Arlington National Cemetery and spoke at it's unvieling - which was sculptedf by a Jewish Confederate Soldier and depicts a Black Confederate Soldier.
While I wait for y'all to bash and trash those democrats, I see where the flag and the KKK were attempted to be linked... Yeah, so? The Klan has used the United States flag since 1866, and let's hear it for WV's own Robert Byrd!!!!!
I am quite proud of my Confederate Heritage given me by birth and my GGGrandfathers. I have nothing to be ashamed no apologize for. *SALUTE* to Wilson!
Good point.
Submitted by Something Stinks on Thu Sep. 10, 2009 8:18 PM PDT.
The American flag is just as much a symbol of racism as the stars and bars. Even more so since they have had far more time to screw over non whites than the brief life of the Confederacy.
Didn't we pass the Civil Rights Act after almost anther hundred more years of treating Blacks as inferiors?
Yeah, lets point our fingers at those dumb southern crackers and ignore history and facts.
Something Stinks!
stars and bars
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Sat Sep. 12, 2009 5:41 PM PDT.
South Carolina wasn't displaying the Stars and Bars...they were displaying a version of a Confederate battle flag, possibly a variation related to SC heritage, maybe not...I can't ever recall seeing any Southern so-called Confederate sympathizer display the Stars and Bars (which is the nickname of the Flag of the Confederacy) on their boat, pickup, motorcycle, etc. They always display some version of a battle flag...a flag that represents war, hatred, violence, death and destruction. The Stars and Bars represents the ideals of the Confederacy...possibly a worthwhile heritage to be proud of...the battle flag doesn't represent those ideals, but that's what gets displayed. Make of it what you will.
I don't know it it's ever happened but can you imagine the outrage from the right if a Democrat had done to a Republican President what Wilson did to Obama?
The Confederate heritage may be an honorable one, but Joe Wilson is doing his best(?) to soil it.
Health Care
Submitted by NancyP on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 5:04 PM PDT.
Obama didn't lie about illegals not getting health care. They are prohibited by law now from getting and the Health Care Bill proposed by Obama expressly states that illegals are ineligible for this coverage. You really need to do your own research.
Robert Byrd would never
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Fri Sep. 18, 2009 9:24 AM PDT.
Robert Byrd would never excuse the rant by Joe Wilson. Senator Byrd is a respectful, intelligent man. The Civil War ended 150 years ago.....get over it. All Americans are equal.
Facts is Facts
Submitted by Something Stinks on Thu Sep. 10, 2009 8:07 PM PDT.
African Americans fought on both sides of the Civil War. Go to a Civil War Reenactment and you may be surprised to seek Black Men wearing the Stars and Bars.
To racists, the flag is about racism.
To others it is history and a part of our heritage. It also is a symbol of rebellion. What is so wrong with rebellion?
Lincoln didn't fight the war to free the slaves, it was to establish that states were not sovereign states, but subordinate to the federal government. When Lincoln "freed" the slaves, he did so only for those rebellious states while leaving those states in the Union free to keep slaves. In fact, the idea of shipping them all back to Africa was why Liberia was founded.
They don't teach that history anymore, do they?
And slavery was replaced with wage slavery which was far more economical since once your workers were too old to work, you didn't have to take care of them. Mother Jones knew something about that.
Something Stinks!
Is that flag a sign of racism?
Submitted by Gary K on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 4:27 AM PDT.
You say, "to racists, the flag is about racism."
Yes, and they promote their racism by flying the flag on top of their capitol, their pickup trucks, and everywhere else.
Have you ever seen a BLACK person flying the confederate flag? I thought not, so STFU.
My dear Gary K,
Submitted by Something Stinks on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 6:03 AM PDT.
I have seen them at Civil War Reenactments following that very flag and wearing gray uniforms.
STFU? What, are you in High School?
Something Stinks!
Something Stinks all right
Submitted by Gary K on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 11:54 AM PDT.
And the smell is coming from your mouth. Who's in High School? All your rambling comments are immature. If you don't have something constructive to say, STFU.
Ad Hominem.
Submitted by Something Stinks on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 12:39 PM PDT.
The only argument a troll has.
Something Stinks!
Is seeing a black flying a
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 12:32 PM PDT.
Is seeing a black flying a Confederate flag taboo? Suppose I said you can see one by the name of HK Edgerton. http://www.southernheritage411.com/
Stanley Lott. Nelson Winbush. The kids who go the the local High School where the mascot is the Rebels. Reenactors. The blacks who began Nu-South. Etc...
I have dozens of pictures from all over that show many people from all races and cultures sporting a Confederate Battleflag. It has flown over and been used since it's creation for many wonderful and amazing things. From use in helping defeat the Japanese in WW2 to the fall of the Berlin Wall. From TV shows like Dukes of Hazzard and Matlock to the Irish County Cork Rebels Hurling Team.
Blacks, Jews, Irish, Scots, English, Whites, Indians, Hispanics, etc have all used it, are using it, and will continue to use it.
Sorry, but I am unable to STFU cause the TRUTH is forcing me to speak up and out!
African Americans fought for the North but not the South
Submitted by MrUniteUs (not verified) on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 4:35 AM PDT.
180,000 African Americans fought for the North but the South
Some plantation owners had slaves cooking and cleaning for them during
the war, but they were banned from fighting, out of fear about which way
they would point the guns. In desperation permission was granted less than month before the end of the war, but the war ended before they saw combat.
The pictures of Black soldiers in Confederate uniforms was nothing more than publicity stunt. They also marched in parade that day and were jeered buy Southern whites.
Next time, Google before you post.
Submitted by Something Stinks on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 6:08 AM PDT.
http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=Black+soldiers+in+Co...
The also fought against the British in the Revolution despite the fact that slavery wouldn't be abolished in their lifetime.
You ignorance is understandable, but if you persist, then that becomes just stupidity.
Something Stinks!
African Americans fought for the North but not the South
Submitted by MrUniteUs (not verified) on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 4:35 AM PDT.
180,000 African Americans fought for the North but the South
Some plantation owners had slaves cooking and cleaning for them during
the war, but they were banned from fighting, out of fear about which way
they would point the guns. In desperation permission was granted less than month before the end of the war, but the war ended before they saw combat.
The pictures of Black soldiers in Confederate uniforms was nothing more than publicity stunt. They also marched in parade that day and were jeered buy Southern whites.
It was about slavery
Submitted by Quiddity who can't login as Quiddity (not verified) on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 7:49 PM PDT.
FiF wrote: "Lincoln didn't fight the war to free the slaves"
You apparently never heard of Lincoln's Second Inaugural (a famous speech). Here's the key excerpt:
"One-eighth of the whole population were colored slaves, not distributed generally over the Union, but localized in the southern part of it. These slaves constituted a peculiar and powerful interest. All knew that this interest was somehow the cause of the war. To strengthen, perpetuate, and extend this interest was the object for which the insurgents would rend the Union even by war ..."
Rebellion?
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Tue Sep. 15, 2009 6:49 AM PDT.
Rebellion against human rights I suppose. How "honorable".
Confederate heritage honorable
Submitted by shaggylord (not verified) on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 2:41 AM PDT.
I suppose it is honorable. If you consider the buying, selling and abuse of people as honorable. But those not-white were not considered to be people. There is only one human race. We just come in a variety of colors, shapes, sizes, mentalities.
But slavery was ok in the north?
Submitted by Something Stinks on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 6:26 AM PDT.
The flag of the United States of America also stood for slavery and for quite a long time before the Confederate flag had its brief 5 year run.
I was raised in the south and moved to the north and guess where I saw more racism and heard the n word more frequently.
This country didn't start being decent when it came to race until the seventies and that really didn't even start until TV gave us "I Spy" and "Star Trek" with the shocking scene of a black woman and a white man kissing. Since I came from the south and actually was familiar with black people, I really liked Bill Cosby and I respected Dr. King. Then came Muhammad Ali. All three are my heroes. We had two black kids in our high school and they were nice and decent people which belied the prejudices of the day.
There is only one race, but this country still buys, sells and abuses people. We just do it with psychology, the media, and dollars and are so slick that you would never know that you are property. We have more people in prison than anyone else just incase someone forgets it.
The USA owns you baby. And your mind too.
Something Stinks!
CSA deserves honor
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 6:27 AM PDT.
I am great-grandson of 2 Confederate Veterans, both my grandmother's father and grandfather's father were in Brunswick County CSA Brigade and their cousin was Col. John Singleton Mosby of J.E.B. Stuart's Confederate Cavalry. In all, the Virginia families in my tree have 15 documented CSA and Confederate Gov't members listed. I am very proud of my ancestors. That they legally held slaves has no bearing on their honor.
This appeared in the Richmond-Times Dispatch obituary of Col. Mosby: 1916, May 30
"With the bitterness of war all gone, there remains to Americans, North and South, a precious heritage of valor, of self-sacrifice, of sturdy, unflagging never-give-up spirit, a heritage which, in future days of possible stress, will prove inspiration unto us."
That is the spirit in which we honor veterans of the War of North Aggression. The Battle Flag is part of our heritage and we have every right to be proud of it. I also have Bacon's Rebellion, American Revolution, WWI & WWII, veterans ancestors All of them from one of the original Jamestown settler families.
It's about now!
Submitted by Mike42 on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 12:36 PM PDT.
Whatever proud Southerners once thought of the Stars & Bars, they allowed it to be hijacked as a symbol of resistance to civil rights. So it is today. Find me one picture of the Confederate flag raised in a rally for civil rights, for racial equality, for diversity.
A lot of people feel the same way about the American flag.
Submitted by Something Stinks on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 1:20 PM PDT.
Does it belong to us, or the fascists, war mongers, corporations and racists?
Until the Civil Rights Act was passed, Old Glory stood for racial inequality and oppression of a significant part of our population.
It still is to a lot of people.
I stopped carrying the flag to rallies after Reagan became President because it no longer stood for America, but for fascism. In hindsight, maybe I was just naive beforehand.
I will take the BLACK flag over any other now.
Something Stinks!
Different Kinds of Honor
Submitted by Youssef51 on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 4:05 PM PDT.
There are elements of the CSA heritage that are honorable.
Rep. Wilson has nothing to do with these. He is a low-down, dime-a-dozen demagogue. A man who would stoop to any depth to advance his wretched career.
If he had been around in the 1860's he would have been a corrupt South Carolina political power broker. The kind of man who wheeled and dealed in comfort and safety for personal profit from Charleston while his neighbors were slaughtered at Antietam and Gettysburg.
Congressman Joe Wilson
Submitted by Isabel (not verified) on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 4:18 PM PDT.
There is nothing wrong for Mr. Wilson to support his heritage and be proud of it. What is wrong when the southerners want to fly their beautiful flag? We allow the communist flags to fly in this great country, including China, Russia, Cuba, Venezuela and all other countries. I was born in Cuba, that does not mean I am a communist and hate this country. On the contrary, I am proud of my ancestors but I hate Castro. I am not a racist but I dislike people like Obama and his friends who want to destroy this Great Country. What about Mr. Bird who belonged to the Klu Klux Klan? What about Acorn and Rev.(?) Wright? I think what is important to people like you is if you agree with their doctrine you are a great person. If you want to destroy the foundation and principles of this Great Country you are a great person. Do what I say not what I do. Thank you Mr. Wilson, you are a great american. God Bless you, the USA and our troops!
What makes Wilson a great
Submitted by NancyP on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 5:11 PM PDT.
What makes Wilson a great American? His conduct wasn't just rude and inappropriate, it was totally unprofessional. His own party censured him for his conduct and he didn't even have his facts straight. If he had really thought that Obama lied he should have held a press conference the next with his own handwritten addendum to prove that he had actually read it and the points that he disagreed with it on and what his sources were.
Joe Wilson a Great American
Submitted by Isabel (not verified) on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 7:28 PM PDT.
Yes, NancyP, Mr. Wilson is a great american. Rude, inappropriate and unprofesional? Seems to me like your talking from a teleprompter. Unlike your friends: the Obamas, the Pelosis, the Reid, etc.etc.etc.. He fought for this Great Country. He does not go to our enemies to apologize for thing we never did. What about a President that does not now that his job is "commander in chief", no "commander on chief". That there is 50 states no 57 states. What about when all these liberals=socialists=communists attack and insult President Bush, getting personal with Sarah Palin and Chenny. Oh, no. That is not rude, inappropiate and unprofesional. Well, NancyP, wake up. After all if this country is so bad, why you do not move to the beautiful, as Dianne Wilson (Texas Congresswoman) put it, Cuba, the paradise of communism.
Firstly, learn how to spell
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Tue Sep. 15, 2009 7:15 AM PDT.
Firstly, learn how to spell if you're going to badger someone with nonsense. Secondly, Wilson is still fighting for the confederacy...I guess he never got the memo that they lost and we are now a UNION. About the whole apologizing thing...Diplomacy is the corner stone of international affairs..something that the cowboy completely lacked. I'm glad you are ok with a war being based completely on lies and thousands of American soldiers dying unjustly...but, us "liberal socialist communists (which doesn't even make sense my friend)" are not ok with that. I guess you are ok with tax money funding constitutional violations--PATRIOT ACT, as well as tax cuts for the wealthiest American's, Daddy's war, etc etc. However, you are not ok with money being spent to provide affordable healthcare (a Human right) to people that cannot afford it. I bet you are one of those people who will gladly accept your medicare check while at the same time telling the administration to get their "hands off your health care". Hypocrisy at it's finest.
A DamnYankee view
Submitted by Cate on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 4:35 PM PDT.
(tried to post this earlier, but don't know what happened)
As a "DamnYankee" (a Northerner living in the South who won't leave) I too felt morally outraged at the amount of Confederate flags around when I moved here, near the capital of the Confederacy. Not to mention the ignorance of the people waving them, who seemed clueless that the rest of us would think of them as racist.
After 7 years down here, I feel two ways about it.
First, the Confederate flag was turned into something ugly by the KKK, something I want to shield my biracial son (wowee! Just like the president!) from. The KKK has made many see the flag and think "racist."
On the other hand, everywhere I turn here, I see another battle marker. And here the Confederacy very much is a representation of rebellion, of freedom from the government. The history is so rich around here that you breathe it.
Also, my experience with North vs. South and racism: there are racists everywhere, of course. Here, you know where you stand with people quite easily when it comes to race issues. Most white people I know in the North put their heads in the sand and pretend they don't see race when they're presented with diversity, yet many of them are just as quick to tell "n---" jokes when they're back with their "own kind". It's not like people are more enlightened in the North; it's just that they're often not as blatant.
I am quite sure that we could find another example of Joe Wilson's racism besides his stubborn support of this flag. Really, it's a poor indicator of racism. Rather, to "good ol boys" like him, it IS heritage. And now, having a son who is descended from Sally Hemmings, it's my heritage too. Slavery is all of our heritage, just as the Civil War is. Just as everything behind the stars and stripes is.
Pssst...(though I never thought I'd agree with some of the commenters here) The Civil War was not fought over slavery. The Emancipation Proclamation was a tactical move, and not a moral one. You'd think that y'all at Mother Jones would have read "The People's History of the United States" by now.
A Black and the flag
Submitted by Cate on Fri Sep. 11, 2009 4:40 PM PDT.
FWIW: I actually HAVE seen a Black guy with the Confederate flag (on his Harley). And yes, it totally threw me off.
Joe Wilson
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Sat Sep. 12, 2009 6:16 AM PDT.
Joe Wilson was labeled a racist because of the flag incident in South Carolina and his recent outburst during the preseidents speech. Whether he is a racist or just an American he believes in states rights, I do not know. However, one thing for sure is "he knows a liar when he listens to one".
south
Submitted by jo wilson (not verified) on Sat Sep. 12, 2009 9:11 AM PDT.
the south WILL RISE AGAIN....LOL..LOL
Joe Wilson's Comment
Submitted by robw (not verified) on Sat Sep. 12, 2009 12:44 PM PDT.
I can't believe the flap caused by Sen. Wilson's comment during Obama's speech. Where were you, Mother Jones, in 2005 when Democrats interrupted then-President Bush's State of the Union speech? Democrats cat-called, jeered, and hissed at President Bush but nary a word was spoken about their behavior. Could it be that most Democrats are weak, spineless cowards who can dish it out but can't take it? I think so.
I've been a reader/occasional subscriber to MJ since the earliest days of publication. Increasingly, MJ fails to report information so readers can make up their own minds. Instead readers are fed liberal, left-wing slop that can't stand the test of time.
Racism & Joe Wilson
Submitted by ROHO1932 (not verified) on Sat Sep. 12, 2009 3:40 PM PDT.
My grandma's best friend was Kate Early a Negro, I always called her Aunt Kate and thought she was my Aunt. I asked how come she was black & I was white, she wasn't sure but try s she may it would not rub off. She taught me about the difference between a black person and a "nigger" using her two sons as the example.
Leroy was married, had two children, worked every day, came home, supported his family, he was a black man. Her other son, Kenneth, was married had a child and worked sometimes, gat a paycheck and gambled & drank it away. He was a "nigger".
But, Aunt Kate said, "niggers" come in all colors, Pat, you will see as you get older.
And indeed she was rite!
Post new comment
MoJo Comments: Send Us Your Feedback
We changed our spam software to better filter comments. Should you encounter any issues, please let us know.
